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25 April 2007

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"The Best and the Brightest" is worth the price of admission. The Cunning Realist has been reprinting excerpts lately, juxtaposing them with current events in Iraq, and it's sad how little some people have learned from history. Also recommend Neil Sheehan's "A Bright Shining Lie," about Lt. Col. John Paul Vann.

Specifically regarding the media staying away from Bush WH early on means we all believed Saddam should have been deposed, regardless of involvement with AQ. His proverbial flip of the nose to the world and UN let us do that and we just fell on our sword afterward, along with the poor post war planning effort. Forget duped, the media bought it b/c they needed any excuse as well as the public to go get that f'er, like the sky is blue today.
As for citizen journalist, bloggers, etc...1/6th of the world is on the internet. So the other 5 billion majority is still going to be too stupid to fall in line, BUT as long as the media keeps surfing the internet pulling useless stories from bloggers, maybe there is hope after all, that it will stay the same and those of us who know what's going on will still be doing what we can to educate the masses. God help us all.

NVH, here's a softball for ya. What would have happened if we had continued containment/no fly and inspections and left Saddam where he was?

Perhaps, just maybe, nothing. No 3500+ American dead, no countless Iraqis dead, no 1/2 trillion down the shitter. Kurds would still have some autonomy, Shia would have been kept down by Saddam, limited opportunities for AQ involvement. Iranians checked and we might have put enough resources into Afganistan to kill Osama Bin Hidin and stabalize the Karzi govt.

Take an objective look, avoid rationale like "flip of the nose to the world" and abused food for oil and let me know if we are really better off w/o that fucker.

What would have happened if the MEDIA, which this post is ABOUT, had taken to task the role of Congress at the time to question the validity of intelligence which they so eloquently have monday morning quarterbacked once the war LOOKED like it wasn't headed our way? OBJECTIVELY, at the time, the risk was greater not knowing than making the assumption that what we had been doing for 12 years would continue to work, Congress, the Public, I agreed. Hindsight's 20/20 but not having made that decision THEN would have been the blind leading the naked.

NVH,

Guess I latched onto this part of your comment "we all believed Saddam should have been deposed" cuz I didn't believe it. So I was working from FORESIGHT, just wanted your take on the what if, but it's cool if you don't wanna go there.

Alright, let's say we didn't, and nothing happened....YET. So we've got the big stick, but instead of whacking people with it we use it as a crutch and the rest of the world percieves that, as it would, pounces on it, as Iran is trying to do now, and Syria behind the scenes, let alone AQ and Hezbollah with all their machinations, and where do we sit? With our thumb up our ass and sucking on the other one. You can sit and ponder your FORESIGHT all you want, the inaction from that pondering leads us to the above situation, so what's your take on that. Oh, and you are VERY convincing starting out with the " Perhaps, maybe" stutter. A little confidence goes a long way Jester...

As Bush the Elder used to say it's about that "vision thing", your buddies policies have wrecked the military, emptied our coffers and has empowered our enemies. PERIOD.

I wasn't stuttering, I was trying to open a tiny orifice in your mind to percive the POSSIBILITIES of the road not taken.

Lost cause, just like BUSHCO and Iraq. Gave you too much credit NVH, won't make that mistake again, my apologies.

Yeah, I see the recruiting goals are being met, the economy is just fine, and well the enemies can be "empowered" all they want, if they weren't they would lie anyway. No doubt management sucks, but it's not the detrimental situation you hope it out to be. As for the road not taken, I've been down it myself, it's a nice view, and has many other branches to take as well, and I was offering only one. Sorry I didn't take yours. Does this mean we can't be friends anymore and I can't expect a lecture to everyone of my posts from now on? Christ, I might cry...

"recruiting goals are being met" Well yeah, you start taking felons, retards, dopers and old men, then yeah we're meeting quota.

I don't "hope" a detrimental situ, I just observe one, and the poor management meme is just a dodge NVH, wake up and smeel what yer shovelin

Here's a hanky

See J. I saw this over at no quarter...you get a guy who rants on like this makes you left leaners look like lunatics. The guy over there actually took a literal shit, I mean wrote it out and everything, as a way to signal his disdain. I'm waiting for the smell GJ, go ahead, prove me wrong...

Left Leaner? You have me mistaken for someone else bub. I only voted D for prez for the first time in 96 after the salmanders contract on america and the GOP putting the corpse of Bob Dole up (he made the lame-o D's of the 80's like Dukakis and Mondale look postively animated) so I voted Clinton. Went Gore on 2K since I knew Bush the Lesser didn't even have daddys nards. Kerry was a douche, I wrote in Bill Bradley.

My first prez vote was for St. Ronnie.

Most of my work thru the 80's and 90's was for defence contractor and the military, hence my appreciation for what they do.

For personal politics I consider myself a moderate libertarian. Salad bar, a little from Goldwater, a little McGovern and a little fucking common sense.

OKAY kids, stop fighting or I'm going to pull this car over. I MEAN IT NOW. Don't make me get ugly. Civil discourse, please.

Well GJ you've proved me wrong. Thank God, I swore if someone were going to pull that on me at this blog I wouldn't go here ever again either ( don't get cute ). You don't want to know what I did thru the 80's mainly b/c if I told you who the first prez I voted for ( and was eligible to vote for ) you and J. would look at me like a nephew mouthing off. It was Clinton in '96, regretted it ever since and swore I would not get duped again about who to go with. Plenty of common sense, I just go ahead and pick the lesser of two evils rather than vote my conscience, so sue me if I think that INVOLVES me more. Look, I don't think we're so diametrically opposed that we have to get into it like this so often, just agree to disagree and move on, three sides to every story, right? Besides, I'm scared of how hard J.'s backhand slap might be if he had to turn the car around.
Sorry J., I didn't think we'd gotten out of the civil realm yet, but hey, it's your blog, thanks.

It's all good (even if you are a punk kid), I enjoy the dialog. Besides, what J gonna do? Ban us? We're the most entertaining fuckers here (and sometimes the only ones!).

In trying to stay in touch with my youth:

TRUE DAT, true dat

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