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22 April 2005

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I've visted that exact test site/circular range, and was told the sheep story during my trip to Dugway as well. All the remaining poles and wires at the abandoned location are old and rusted, but it was a bit weird to stand at 'ground zero' and think of all the CW/BW that must have been dispersed right there... still not as spooky as crawling around *inside* the crumbling VX plant at Newport wearing protective gear (just in case) though.

No kidding! I bet you have some very interesting stories there. I have never been to Dugway - may get the opportunity later this year or next year. Looking forward to it. I think they tore down that Newport building last year, didn't they?

Ah, so you think pesticide spray killed the sheep.

How about this - rather than the Army's estimate of 2% of the VX falling outside Dugway, how about their estimate being horribly wrong? Maybe 98% fell outside Dugway?

Your ppt map is a very good representation of the area.

I was there. I picked up and buried a good number of the dead sheep. I've read The Stone Report. Winds strong enough to blow over a trailer minutes after the test. Storms to the north and south minutes after the test. Without a doubt, the Army test cloud moved off the grid, off Dugway, into Skull Valley, across Johnson Pass, and into Rush Valley where sheep were sickened. This is something like 60 miles total. 2% of the test volume did not do this.

At the time I proposed that a PR story be released blaming the deaths on a range war between the sheep herders and cattlemen. No one seemed to think this would fly, so the Army has essentially stonewalled for 35 years.

J.-So whose version is correct? I just finished Tucker's chapter on it, and HIS seems a bit more ACCURATE than yours. Now coming from where he is, liberal arms control guy, to where you are from, Army Chem School faithful supporter, and you're on a blog and he wrote book, thereby implying more detail should be located in his book, I get it. But what I'm getting from you is you think the ranchers who said they hadn't sprayed yet, were "warring" with one another and pesticides for their crops were used possibly "inadvertantly" to kill the sheep? Is that right? According to Tucker there was still a couple Liquid gallons of VX outside the range that got caught up in the maelstrom of weather. Liquid VX is Highly persistent right, and it wasn't EXACTLY VX, but a chem derivative, so...I don't know, it's not like winning the lottery, but the M&S guys can make it look probable both ways...

Tucker is wrong on the Dugway incident and on the chemical demilitarization program. He lets his liberal bias creep into his academic discussion. If you want a book reference, see Mauroni, "America's Struggle with Chemical-Biological Warfare," chapter 2, for a full discussion of said topic.

Did you view the ppt in the post? Do the math. About 98 percent of the agent is accounted for on the reservation, 80 percent of which was on a target grid. Figure out how many acres of land that remaining two percent of agent would have landed, and tell me that's an incapacitating dose for sheep. It's not remotely probable. Dugway had routinely done hundreds of simulant and agent testing since before 1945 - twenty plus years of experience, never an incident.

If there were heavy winds - and the Stone Report does show all the wind data at the test site, at least - the result would be increased dispersion of the aerosol over several square miles, not the deposition of a lethal mass of agent on the sheep. Not enough agent, too great of a distance, and (btw) no other animal/human indications of depressed acetylcholinesterase levels in the area. The science ought to trump the hype here.

Before the EPA was around, ranchers could use whatever they wanted on their crops. So here we have a few thousand uninsured sheep who get sick - but do not die - of ingesting (not skin contact) an organophosphate (not proven to be VX). Ranchers panic. It's an election year (1968), and the governor and the congressional delegation leak to the press that the Army's Cold War testing is the culprit (before any investigation is concluded). Press goes wild (military story - scandle/coverup).

Army does tests, meanwhile one-star gets flown in from Wash DC to tell the press "unless we prove otherwise, it does look like we're culpable." He returns to DC to tell Army leadership the story, and the generals decide to pay off the ranchers and make the problem go away without admitting any guilt. Problem is, the press and the Congress can't let that happen, it's too good of an election-year story.

So the ranchers shoot the sheep and start burying them, counting on the governor to put the screws to the Army for the money. Occam's razor. Short of a CSI team, that's my story.

Well, let me just call up William Peterson on my cellie and see what he has to say about it? Look, I know it's highly improbable with regards to the amount of agent left spread out over such a large area. And no chance you coud calculate up to an incapacitating dose, even for sheep w/o butyrylcholinesterase (damn, I've been reading way too much). I guess I gotta look at Mauroni's other book, now. Dammit, where can I get it used?

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